Ciao a Tutti!
In my previous posts I talked about my personal point of view on Italian vs (Italian-)American cuisine, but I thought that interviewing a person with more expertise would be better! That’s why I decided to talk and interview one of the Italian Professor’s here at Dickinson College. Prof. Luca Trazzi “specialized in English and French linguistics and Italian language pedagogy […]. At Dickinson he teaches elementary and intermediate Italian courses, acts as the current Italian faculty liaison for the MWC, and participates in the organization of Italian events on campus” … and in addition to all this he is a fantastic cook – to the question “How do you like to relax?” his answer is “Cooking … cooking everything from Italian dishes to sushi!”
Let’s see what he answered to the “few” questions I asked him:
1. What was your reaction to the American food when you first came in the States – for a long period of time?
The first time I came to the States for a long period of time was 11 years ago – here at Dickinson College – I was both the Italian TA and a student. The first (daily) reaction to the American food was in the “Cafeteria”, but I also had American friends at that time and I had already tasted American food with them. I can comment on both these different situations. So first of all, as a student eating at the “Caf”, I was really surprised by the QUANTITY of food available for the students. I remember that I immediately looked at food that was labeled as Italian food that, of course, captured my attention: there was a place in the cafeteria where it was possible to order pasta – wok – with vegetables and chicken together and right away I compared it to what I was used to eating and when I ate there I was looking for my “sapori” (tastes/flavors) and what I was used to: pasta, meat, the structure of lunch/dinner (first the first course, the second, and sides). Of course, I soon found out that I was allowed to have just one plate
where I had to put everything on it, but, because I had a tray, I still divided my food according to the Italian structure and that surprised everyone around me. That was for both lunch and dinner. I liked breakfast, though. Because I heard a lot about continental breakfasts, American pancakes, different kind of cereals, eggs and bacon (or sausages): I liked doing experiments during breakfast but at the end, I always ended up with cereal with milk or toast with butter and jam – I just liked to know that I had all of these different things but I never used them! On Sundays though, I dared to try more things because of the well-known “brunch”: it was more an imitation of American lifestyle – I am in the States and I can eat eggs and bacon at breakfast!
On the other hand, outside the college environment, my American friends introduced me to typical American meals that were far away from the stereotypes. I thought that American food meant hamburgers, French fries, eggs and bacon, thanksgiving turkey, and that’s it! These friends from both the east and west coasts prepared typical local or regional meals and also family recipes.
2. How long is it that you’ve been living in the States? And, did your relationship with food change?
Now, it’s been almost 6 years that I have lived in the States and now I distinguish two types of American food: mass consumption food (junk food, …) and traditional – local and regional – food. I totally avoid everything that belongs to mass production food – stereotypical meals – but I appreciate things that American’s eat during specific periods of the year like Thanksgiving Dinner, BBQ, and so on.
3. What do you miss most about Italian?
First of all, I miss the structure of the courses: I miss that when I sit at the table I know that there’s going to be “un primo” (pasta) and “un secondo” (meat) – I miss the “table experience.” I miss the bread (“il pane”) because personally I am one of those people who eats pasta with bread, “la
polenta” (cornmeal mush) with bread – my family jokes about it because it’s not a common thing – I don’t miss pasta that much because I like cooking and I cook it at home, but I miss “i sapori” which I grew up with – childhood flavors that luckily I can recreate cooking at home, the problem is that I miss the “table experience,” the convivial experience. When I cook and eat with other Italians living here it’s not a problem anymore because we cook together, we sit at the table, there’s a precise structure that everybody knows, and then while we eat, the food itself is important and a main topic of conversation; while with the Americans the meal is just food, there are no memories, stories, and so on – with the Italians there’s always a “I remember this recipe because my mother, when I grew up, or in your city, or in the North/South, …” – the food moves to the background. The focus – topic of eating with Italians is to appreciate and taste food together.
4. What do you miss most about Italian habits related to food? And/or about daily habits (like breakfast, lunch, dinner, and breaks during the day)?
I miss having breakfast at the “bar” [from now on, I will use bar to talk about café shops], I miss waking up and going directly to the bar: next door there will always be a bar with a “caffè macchiato” and a “cornetto” (croissant or pastry) waiting for me! Here, I prepare the Moka, of course, but it isn’t the same thing! I miss sharing my time with poeple. When you eat here you eat for the sake of eating, you eat because you have to! While in Italy, it is “we have to eat, so let’s spend some time together”: it’s both a matter of quantity and quality of time! I miss lunch time which is usually in the office, although I also did this in Italy it was different! Dinner is similar to the Italian experience but still both lunch and dinner time in Italy are linked to the “telegiornale” (newscast).
If I have a 30-minute break, I cannot say “let’s go grab a coffee” to my American colleagues! Well, I do it but with my Italians colleagues because they know what I mean! It means relax for thirty minutes, drink a coffee while we gossip, smoke a cigarette and that’s it! Americans do not understand going to grab a coffee at random moments of the day! They ask for the purpose, or usually they say “Do you need to talk to me about something?”.
5. Is there a different vibe or feeling around a “lunch/dinner table”? Like rules, behavior, or different habits to respect?
“Galateo” (manners) is quite the same. Fork and knife are the opposite, though. I’m used to eating by cutting the meat with the knife in my right hand and then grabbing a piece with the fork in my left hand. Also, you’re not supposed to put your hands on the table, instead you put them on your legs. Here, there’s way more conversation about all kind of topics! I’m generalizing of course, I’m telling you my own experience. Dinner is a time to get to know people, dinner is a social event here in the States. People with different jobs, age, and so on at the same table talking about various topics is not common in Italy at all!
6. Are there any American meals that you like?
First of all, I like eating, I like the culinary experience, I like “stare a tavola” (to sit at the table and talk), I like tasting different things: Italian, American, Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Indian, and so on. I couldn’t and I don’t want to substitute one thing for another – the Italian breakfast is a thing, the American brunch is a totally different thing. I like both but I don’t want to replace anything: I have to be honest when I have brunch, I like drinking American coffee, but if I am in Italy, I would never order it! It’s the same thing when I am in Italy, after lunch I want my caffé macchiato, not the American one! There are things that I really like but they have to be contextualized. So, back to the question, I like everything that comes from a diner, I love the diner’s experience! The funny thing that I found out is that Americans that go to Italy love “l’Autogrill” (roadside/highway restaurant). Personally, I like that too. I also like the American contemporary cuisine which is a fusion between European (French and Italians) techniques and typical American meals. I like everything that is a traditional meal, too. I love Thanksgiving Day meals, and also local and regional meals, or the casseroles. Well done Hamburgers, for examples, are amazing!
7. How is doing the grocery shopping experience different from Italy?
Doing grocery shopping hasn’t changed much! When I am in a grocery store in the States, I behave as I did in Italy: it’s an important moment and it takes time! I read the labels, I think about the ingredients, I try to save money too and I look, I watch, and I see! As I said, I love cooking so I need to spend time in the grocery store to see new things, etc: I love grocery shopping although I heard that most Americans hate it – they don’t like to experiment with food!
If I want Italian products, I look for the ingredients not for the final product! I look for products imported from Italy, but I avoid imitations. Recently, there are new stores in the States where you can also find particular products – yeah, they are very expensive.
8. Can you tell us something about the relationship between Italians and Americans recipes (ingredients, preparation, and different types)?
In the States, recipes are gold. Quantities are very important and strict – you can’t mess them up! It’s mechanical. I understand that sometimes recipes are needed and necessary – it’s chemistry – but for Italians they follow these recipes “q.b.” (“quanto basta” – as needed). It’s interesting to see the difference, though. In Italy, if I have to prepare or tell somebody to prepare “spaghetti all’amatriciana,” it’s pretty much everything q.b., random, as much as you like, and so on. Contrary, in the States, it’s pretty much one tablespoon of oil for the pan, two pieces of bacon – we’d say more or less, as much bacon as you have in the fridge, my Granma’d say “yeah, more or less, one egg, two eggs, it depends! I’m used to saying two or three tablespoons of something, Italians soon understand it, here they would ask me “two or three?!”: q.b. vs tablespoon! Also, in Italy we have a theory of not wasting anything, everything is “recycled.”
9. Italian-American food vs Italian food, can you explain the differences?
My relation with the Italian-American food, changed a lot during the years. At first, it was negative: what I used to say was “I don’t care – this is not Italian!”. Then, I understood and learned the reasons why it was like this! “Why Italians and the Italian-American changed the food so badly?”: I found out that the origins of all these meals are actually Italian. At the end of 19th century and at beginning of the 20th century, Italians who came to the States wanted to recreate their own meals but without the same ingredients that actually were too hard to get at the time – some of them are still hard to find nowadays. “Bisogna saper fare di necessità, 
virtù” (Necessity is the mother of invention or when life gives you lemons, make a lemonade)! I started understanding these meals, I still don’t like them because I’m not used to them. But I also found out that in some part of Italy people use different ingredients than I’m used to. So, it’s just a matter of culinary contamination and a lack of original ingredients.
The only thing I’m actually sorry about is that Italian-Americans are kind of stuck in the past, I respect their meals but why don’t they modify it a little bit? Make them better? Evolve them in a sense? People like them though! So if you like something why do you have to change it? I’m sorry that other people think and associate those meals with Italy/Italians. On the other hand, things are changing nowadays according to – real – Italian food or meals. More people, now, know that there’s a distinction between Italian and Italian-American meals – they know that spaghetti meatballs are a stereotype!
10. I know but let’s be formal: Do you like cooking? If yes, can you give the readers one last ultimate tip?
There’s a lack of curiosity, of willingness to try: “if it’s not chicken, I’m not gonna taste it!” – it’s still good, try it!
So, guys: Try, Explore, and be Curious!
And that’s almost it! I had to cut a lot of questions and answers because of the length of the interview but I think that as a first approach to a general overview of the two different cultures, this is pretty exhaustive!
FYI, soon I’ll post a video-interview about Americans who lived in Italy for a long time and of course their reaction … just to have a wider point of view on the matter! 😉
A presto!
